Topic-icon Pro14 structure

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4 months 2 weeks ago #55371 by Mark Mostyn
Mark Mostyn created the topic: Pro14 structure
No idea where to put this so just going to leave it here

www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/40122015

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4 months 2 weeks ago #55372 by salmson
salmson replied to the topic: Pro14 structure

Mark Mostyn wrote: No idea where to put this so just going to leave it here

www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/40122015


That's a BBC Scotland source. Are we sure the Cheetahs franchise has been asked to join the Pro12, or are Edinburgh just signing their squad en masse?
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4 months 2 weeks ago #55374 by columoc
columoc replied to the topic: Pro14 structure
RTE conform the invite and suggest that the Kings from PE have been invited also.
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4 months 2 weeks ago - 4 months 2 weeks ago #55375 by pinky
pinky replied to the topic: Pro14 structure

columoc wrote: RTE conform the invite and suggest that the Kings from PE have been invited also.


RTE confirmed nothing - they just referenced the BBC Scotland report!

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"We haven’t liked the wind and rain for about four years now" - John Muldoon 1/1/2015
Last Edit: 4 months 2 weeks ago by pinky.

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4 months 2 weeks ago #55379 by Rex
Rex replied to the topic: Pro14 structure
And I thought Northampton was a pain in hole to get to! Be a nice away trip!

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3 months 3 weeks ago #55659 by columoc
columoc replied to the topic: Pro14 structure
Same old story? ....or has there been movement?

www.balls.ie/rugby/forget-pro12-going-pro14-september-368125

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3 months 3 weeks ago #55660 by Mark Mostyn
Mark Mostyn replied to the topic: Pro14 structure

columoc wrote: Same old story? ....or has there been movement?

www.balls.ie/rugby/forget-pro12-going-pro14-september-368125


Would it be worth starting a new thread for general Pro12 chat? Obviously there's nothing official here, but as we've seen with the Erasmus situation, there's usually no smoke without fire when a story is so widely reported by the rugby media.

It's no secret that the Pro12 want to expand into South Africa, but this seems a bit rushed to me. Will the Cheetahs and Kings be in the Vodacom Cup this year? How on Earth are they meant to be in any way competitive playing two full seasons in a row with no break?! On top of generally being a bit rubbish.

Ignoring that, how do you structure the league? Two options have been mentioned:

Maintain current league structure

I think most people can agree 26 games is too much. What the Pro12 needs is less games with more international talent, not more games with less international talent.

Two conferences of 7, teams play other teams within their conference home and away, and teams in the other conference home or away

You only need to look at Super Rugby to see how much of a disaster conferences are. The 4 Irish and Welsh teams would have to be kept together as neither Union will agree to lose their interpros. The Irish conference is already harder, before you even consider how to split up the other teams.

I'm not a fan.

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3 months 3 weeks ago #55661 by Decadence
Decadence replied to the topic: Pro14 structure
Agreed, new thread created for all 'future of Pro12' conversation

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3 months 3 weeks ago #55662 by pinky
pinky replied to the topic: Pro14 structure
I'm not sure it's widely reported so much as reported one place and widely quoted in a lot of others, but you would assume the BBC have pretty good sources. Should be borne in mind though that there was similar talk of North American expansion a while back based on a Scotsman report and nothing's come of that so far.

In format terms, 2x7 wouldn't really work as it would mean at least one country's teams would have to be split up.
Simplest way would be to retain the current format but each team plays nine other teams twice (including all the teams from their own country) and the four other teams only once (to be decided by draw).
Dunno how the Italian situation will work out over the next few years - they could end up down a team yet.

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3 months 3 weeks ago - 3 months 3 weeks ago #55663 by connemara man
connemara man replied to the topic: Pro14 structure
This is so stupid on so many levels. Firstly on a player welfare issue of travelling to South Africa for over a week to play two matches the travel time alone is ridiculous. (Connacht had to effectively split their squad for a trip to Enisei)
Then the matches will be played in fairly attritional conditions because it'll be their summer so added heat and stress on the body not to mention that the pitches will be harder which will lead to more injuries.And that's all before the toll of extra games gets factored in.

The price to go down there will be a huge cost for teams. Budgets as they are, are fairly tight and who will fit the bill?
Then the cost and burden for fans I know I won't pay to go down to watch 2 regular season games.
Then price of the Rahn that cost will be extortionate for the teams themselves to the point I'd say it'll be more of a burden than the money the the Italians were paying before you factor in the cost to the club renting the ground and training facilities in London.

It's a joke there are things that the pro 12 could do to make the league we have more marketable but too much work involved, it's a cross border league, there's a lot more that can be done to improve its image and they have been going about it recently and haven't given the league the chance to bed in. It is a baby league in terms of history and throwing in new teams whose good players are being signed by the teams staying in the S15 is going to start that process again somewhat.

And conference systems can go feck of, look at the GAA as it is technically a conference system and its a completely lopsided competition. Ulster in football having the only competitive part of it. in the other 3 its Dublin, Mayo or Galway and Kerry or Cork. And Hurling one competitive conference in Munster. And most pundits agree that something needs to be done to fix it as the championship only comes to life in late July
The NFL works in the way because of the draft system that kind of keeps teams to a degree level, which isn't going happen anytime soon in rugby.

That's not even to mention the cluster feck that will be European qualification.

BAD BAD IDEA
Last Edit: 3 months 3 weeks ago by connemara man.
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3 months 3 weeks ago #55664 by Podge57
Podge57 replied to the topic: Pro14 structure
Connemara man - stop sitting on the fence on this one!

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3 months 3 weeks ago #55665 by connemara man
connemara man replied to the topic: Pro14 structure
I'm just trying to be diplomatic
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3 months 3 weeks ago #55666 by pinky
pinky replied to the topic: Pro14 structure
I reckon the Pro12 just figured they'd leak the story and see what Connemara Man says on the Clan forum. If he likes it, we go with it.
Idea is surely canned now. Good work CM.

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3 months 3 weeks ago #55667 by connemara man
connemara man replied to the topic: Pro14 structure

pinky wrote: I reckon the Pro12 just figured they'd leak the story and see what Connemara Man says on the Clan forum. If he likes it, we go with it.
Idea is surely canned now. Good work CM.


Just some initial thoughts of course :)

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3 months 3 weeks ago #55668 by Mark Mostyn
Mark Mostyn replied to the topic: Pro14 structure

pinky wrote: I'm not sure it's widely reported so much as reported one place and widely quoted in a lot of others


Fair point, but the Pro12's own survey had questions about travelling to South Africa so it's not like it's complete pie in the sky stuff. Doesn't mean it's happening this season, or at all, mind you.

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3 months 3 weeks ago #55669 by columoc
columoc replied to the topic: Pro14 structure
I think there is noise now because of the impending Super Rugby announcement in a weeks time. I cannot see how SA team would work in Pro 12 without significant increase of TV money. I think the Super Rugby TV deal is worth somewhere north of $70m per year, whereas Pro12 is around €6m (I don't know right numbers). Kings have always been a struggle financially, and were out of Super Rugby for a few years before coming back in 2016. Cheetahs will be unfortunate losers here as they have good support.
Cannot see North America teams working out either without big ESPN or Fox money and I don't think the audience is there for that.

Best development would be a Georgian team, it would be well funded locally, along lines of Argentinian Jaguares. It might allow a similar Super Italy club also which is competitive and keep it at 12.

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